14 Attachment 2 - September 11, 2019 Verbatim MinutesLOS GATOS PLANNING COMMISSION 9/11/2019
Item #2, Town Code Amendment – Demolition Regulations
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A P P E A R A N C E S:
Los Gatos Planning
Commissioners:
Matthew Hudes, Chair
Melanie Hanssen, Vice Chair
Mary Badame
Kendra Burch
Kathryn Janoff
Reza Tavana
Town Manager:Laurel Prevetti
Community Development
Director:
Joel Paulson
Town Attorney:Robert Schultz
Transcribed by: Vicki L. Blandin
(619) 541-3405
ATTACHMENT 2
LOS GATOS PLANNING COMMISSION 9/11/2019
Item #2, Town Code Amendment – Demolition Regulations
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P R O C E E D I N G S:
CHAIR HUDES: We'll now move on to Item 2, which
is Town Code Amendment Application A-19-007. The project is
Town Wide, the Applicant is the Town of Los Gatos, and it's
to consider amendments to Chapter 29, which are the Zoning
Regulations of the Town Code regarding demolition
regulations.
Ms. Armer, I understand you'll be giving the
Staff Report.
JENNIFER ARMER: Yes, good evening. Good evening,
Chair, Vice Chair, Commissioners.
The item in front of you is consideration of
changes to the definition of "demolition" and "wall" as
recommended by the Town Council Policy Committee and
forwarded to you for your recommendation to Town Council.,
The recommendation from Policy Committee impacts the
current definition of demolition and the definition of wall
in the following ways:
For demolition it's deleting the text, "The
remaining exterior walls must retain either existing
interior or existing exterior wall covering," so that we
would be considering the framing of the wall as
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constituting the wall without having to retain those
exterior wall coverings.
It would also include revising the repair
exception that was recently approved to remove reference to
wall coverings since that would no longer be necessary.
In addition to that, these changes included in
Exhibit 4 also include changes to the definition of wall to
remove any reference to wall covering and combine the wall
covering for exterior and interior walls into one
definition for simplification.
These changes are intended to streamline the land
use process and reduce costs for remodels of existing
homes.
This concludes Staff's presentation but I'd be
happy to answer any questions.
CHAIR HUDES: Thank you. Are there any questions?
Vice Chair Hanssen.
COMMISSIONER HANSSEN: I just had one question.
We had heard previously from several architects that there
were issues of mold in the walls, so my only question is
that the Policy Committee has reviewed this but do we know
if other jurisdictions are using framing as a definition
for the means to determine whether it's a technical
demolition or not?
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JENNIFER ARMER: Each municipality does have
different ways of defining demolition in terms of what the
percentage is, whether it's linear feet or the area of the
wall, whether the roof is considered, and how they define
wall. It's something that we've done a little bit of
looking into but it is not always clear what their
interpretation is just on a quick research.
JOEL PAULSON: I would just add that for
reference the City of Saratoga does not include wall
coverings. They've made an interpretation and they just
look at the framing, just for your reference.
CHAIR HUDES: Great, thank you. Any other
questions? Commissioner Janoff.
COMMISSIONER JANOFF: Thank you. This demolition
definition refers parenthetically to non-historic
structures. How would historic structures be affected or
unaffected by this change in definition?
JENNIFER ARMER: Policy Committee's
recommendation specifically was not recommending changes to
the historic side of this, so the requirement that the
exterior wall surface be retained, that only 25-percent of
those side face the street, all of that would be maintained
as is currently defined.
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COMMISSIONER JANOFF: As I recall, some of the
discussion from the architects had to do with historic
structures and not knowing whether you'd have integrity of
wall until you got to the framing.
JENNIFER ARMER: And they will still have the
ability to request the repair and replace those exceptions
that are currently in the code.
COMMISSIONER JANOFF: Okay, so repair would allow
for that interpretation. Okay, thank you.
CHAIR HUDES: Okay, thank you. Other questions?
So, at this point we'll now invite comments from members of
the public on Item 2. I have one card here but if anyone
else wishes to speak, please submit a card. Gary Kohlsaat.
GARY KOHLSAAT: Good evening, Commissioners.
Thank you for being here on the 9/11 anniversary.
I am extremely encouraged by this movement that
I'm seeing in Los Gatos to listen to the professionals and
be willing to change and modify and tweak the rules.
This has been one rule that personally I've gone
up against many, many times and really kind of frustrated,
very frustrated. I'm used to it, but none of my clients
are, so I have to explain it every time.
As Mr. Paulson said, Saratoga defines a wall by
the framing. I have a large project in Saratoga right now.
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We couldn't demo the house but we could strip all the walls
off, all the materials on both sides, which makes it much
easier to do several things.
The first time the Planning Commission looked at
the demolition rules to be changed several months ago I
spoke on behalf of that and I listed four examples. I'm not
going to do those today but I really want to kind of get
into the logistics of how homes are built and inspected and
the sequence of it.
It's very important because when you're building
a house you'll frame a house, you'll frame the walls, and
then you'll put your plywood on there, and then we get an
inspection, and almost every wall is going to have shear
plywood on that. You get that inspected, you get it nailed
off, and then you put building paper on there, known as a
vapor barrier.
You can't do any electrical, insulation, anything
like that until you have your house watertight. There are
some exceptions, and the building officials now have to
grant exceptions if we're in the case that we're saving the
interior surface of the wall and in a situation where we
want to remove the outside surfaces, leaving drywall or
plaster.
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So now you're doing everything from the outside.
You're installing wiring, plumbing, insulation, and those
are all supposed to be done when you're watertight, so it
really puts a bind on the contractor and his subcontractors
and the building officials to be able to switch back and
forth between inspecting rough inspections on your
electrical, all your utilities, and then coming back from
insulation inspection and then getting your shear ply
nailing on that, so it just really is awkward.
But more importantly, what we're trying to do is
build homes that are watertight, airtight to a certain
degree, and it's very difficult if we have to maintain
these surfaces, especially next to your surface, and not
only historic homes but homes built… We've encountered
homes built in the fifties, sixties, seventies that had
little or no vapor barriers, and when a contractor wants to
put his warranty on this project they always complain that
they can't waterproof, they can't flash a window, so here
they have a product that's brand new almost, remodeled, but
it's not warrantied.
So, I just really applaud you guys and I
encourage you guys to consider what the Policy Committee is
recommending and Staff is recommending, and I speak for
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several architects. A lot of them couldn't come tonight,
but hopefully I can carry the flag.
CHAIR HUDES: Okay, thank you. Are there
questions?
First of all, I wanted to thank you for engaging
in this process back at the Historic Preservation Committee
and then at the Policy Committee, because I think that
having the practical input from people who are actually
involved in the work is very important to getting things
right. I know it took us a couple of tries to get this
finished, so we'll see where we go with it tonight.
But just so that I understand and maybe the
public can understand, when something goes to technical
demo is it the case then once that happens then the project
has to comply with current codes, including things like
curbs and gutters and bike lanes and things like that?
GARY KOHLSAAT: That's correct.
CHAIR HUDES: So, that's where the expense… It
triggers an expense above and beyond just doing the work if
it's called to have a technical demo?
GARY KOHLSAAT: Yes, it does trigger that. Many
times it would also trigger a DRC or Planning Commission
approval, so those extra steps that clients have to
consider.
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I don't think anybody is against undergrounding
utilities and putting in sidewalks and things like that,
but if you have a house, maybe it's an old ranch house that
had wood siding on the front for curbside appeal and for
economy reasons they did stucco on the other three sides
and you just want to put siding on all four sides so your
house actually complies with the Los Gatos Design Standards
that all the elevations should kind of match and work with
each other. You're trying to comply with what the Town is
proposing or supporting but in order to just put siding
over stucco or take the stucco off and put siding on, both
would be considered demolition, by the way, if you didn't
have the inside up. Many times we're remodeling the inside,
stripping all the asbestos laden drywall; you have to get
all the drywall out these days. So, now this client has to
go, "Well, how badly do I want my house to look good on the
side of the house if I have to pay for other expenses that
were not necessarily in the budget?"
So, yes, it certainly does complicate things to
go to technical demo and especially for reasons like this
that are I'm not really tearing any walls down, so again,
show me the demo.
CHAIR HUDES: Okay. Thank you very much,
appreciate it.
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GARY KOHLSAAT: Thank you.
CHAIR HUDES: I don't see any other cards on this
topic, is that correct? Okay, so we'll now close the public
portion of the public hearing, and another opportunity for
questions for Staff. Any questions or discussion? Okay.
Discussion or a motion? Commissioner Badame.
COMMISSIONER BADAME: I'll try a motion. It seems
pretty cut and dried and this makes sense. Appreciate the
input from the architects, from the Staff, and the Policy
Committee.
I move to forward a recommendation of approval to
Town Council for Town Code Amendment Application A-19-007,
consideration of amendments to Chapter 29 (Zoning
Regulations) of the Town Code regarding demolition
regulations. I can make the findings for CEQA and the
required findings for the General Plan per Exhibit 1.
CHAIR HUDES: Okay, thank you. Vice Chair
Hanssen.
COMMISSIONER HANSSEN: I second the motion.
CHAIR HUDES: Okay, we have a motion and a
second. Any discussion? Then I will call the question. All
in favor? Opposed? Passes unanimously 6-0. Thank you.
I guess there are no appeal rights, is that
correct? This is a recommendation.
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SALLY ZARNOWITZ: That's correct, this is a
recommendation to Council.
CHAIR HUDES: Okay, thank you.
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