Attachment 5 - April 26, 2023 Planning Commission Verbatim MinutesLOS GATOS PLANNING COMMISSION 4/26/2023
Item #2, Land Use and
Economic Recovery Town Code Amendments
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A P P E A R A N C E S:
Los Gatos Planning
Commissioners:
Jeffrey Barnett, Chair
Steve Raspe, Vice Chair
Susan Burnett
Melanie Hanssen
Kathryn Janoff
Emily Thomas
Town Manager: Laurel Prevetti
Community Development
Director:
Joel Paulson
Town Attorney: Gabrielle Whelan
Transcribed by: Vicki L. Blandin
(619) 541-3405
ATTACHMENT 5
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P R O C E E D I N G S:
CHAIR BARNETT: We’ll now move on to Agenda Item
2, which is a request that the Planning Commission forward
a recommendation to the Town Council on Land Use and
Economic Recovery Amendments to Chapter 29 (Zoning
Regulations) of the Town of Los Gatos Code Regarding
Personal Service Businesses, Bars and Markets, Banks and
Financial Services, Formula Retail, Group Classes,
Veterinarians Offices, and the Definitions, and the
proposed amendments to the Town Code are not considered a
CEQA project.
I’ll ask if there are any disclosures by the
Commissioners. Seeing none, I’ll ask if Staff has a report
on Item #2.
SEAN MULLIN: Thank you and good evening.
Throughout the years the Council has identified strategic
priorities related to community vitality, economic
recovery, permit streamlining, and policies and ordinances
related to supporting the business community. In line with
these priorities Staff has brought forth a series of policy
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and ordinance changes over time offering reduced costs,
streamlined processes, and flexibility.
In response to the pandemic emergency the Town
Council adopted an Economic Recovery Resolution to provide
businesses with options for flexibility to modify their
business offerings. As a result, the Town experienced fewer
vacancies and business attrition during the pandemic and
was quick to assist businesses in reopening.
The Council recently adopted a priority related
to economic vitality and pandemic recovery, and tonight as
a first step Staff is bringing forward recommendations for
code amendments to formalize some components of the
Economic Recovery Resolution and to continue the
streamlining work that began prior to the pandemic
emergency to support the business community during the
recovery.
Your Staff Report and exhibits detail the six
subjects for which Staff is seeking a recommendation from
the Commission to the Council, and briefly these six items
are: 1) Allowing personal service businesses as a permitted
use in the C-2 and O zones; 2) Defining new uses to
increase flexibility and opportunity for different business
models within the restaurants to bars spectrum; 3)
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Introducing new definitions for banks and financial
investment services to better clarify the uses; 4) Reducing
regulatory impediments to large formula retail businesses;
5) Allowing group classes as permitted use in the C-2 zone;
and 6) allowing veterinarians without a kennel to operate
in the C-1 zone with a CUP. A thorough discussion of each
topic is included with your Staff Report. An addendum has
been distributed including public comments received after
publishing the Staff Report.
In conclusion Staff recommends the Planning
Commission review and provide a motion on each of the
proposed amendments and forward a recommendation to the
Town Council.
Along with Planning Staff, Monica Renn, the
Town’s Economic Vitality Manager, is here tonight to
support your discussion and answer any questions you might
have.
This concludes my presentation and I’m happy to
answer any questions.
CHAIR BARNETT: Thank you, Mr. Mullin. Are there
questions from the Commissioners? Commissioner Hanssen.
COMMISSIONER HANSSEN: I have two questions. One
is about a personal service business. I seem to remember
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reading in the news a while ago that there were some
issues, and I did a little bit of checking. There has been
on and off issues with massage parlors and illicit
activities of various sorts, none that I could find in Los
Gatos, but in the Bay Area, San Jose and whatnot. I didn’t
see it clearly called out as a permitted use in the
discussion, but then when I looked at the definitions page
massage therapist was in there, so my question is do we
have a reason to maybe think twice about that particular
category?
SEAN MULLIN: Thank you for that question. I know
you have a follow up as well. It is permitted in certain
zones, and those massage therapists that want to come in
and open that business need to obtain a Use and Occupancy
Permit as well, and under that permit process they need to
receive clearance from the police department and provide
that information to the Town. That’s how the Town typically
is regulating it, and the Commission could discuss carving
that out if that’s something that they’re amenable to.
COMMISSIONER HANSSEN: I was just kind of
curious, and I do imagine that we have not only code
enforcement but also our police department, so should
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anything like that happen and people report it, it could be
addressed.
SEAN MULLIN: To follow up on that, the
regulations that we’re looking at in the C-2 zone are real
specific location-wise. It’s really about ground floor in
the C-2 zone. In other zones it’s a permitted use, and in
the C-2 zone if you’re not ground floor it’s a permitted
use.
COMMISSIONER HANSSEN: Very good. My other
question is about the formula retail, which has been a big
discussion topic for many, many years. There was a time
where I thought we used to track the percentage of large
retail versus smaller retail. Do we do that anymore, and
where do we stand?
MONICA RENN: Monica Renn, Economic Vitality
Manager. We stopped tracking that back when we got rid of
the formula retail regulations for establishments fewer
than 6,000 square feet. Right now the question is do we
want to expand that to those over 6,000 square feet? I
could probably quickly look down North Santa Cruz on a map
and come up with a number for you, but since the removal of
that regulation I think we’ve only even had one or two come
in, and that was in 2018.
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COMMISSIONER HANSSEN: Okay, very good.
CHAIR BARNETT: Do other Commissioners have
questions of Staff? I’m not seeing any, so we’ll now open
the public portion of the public meeting and invite
comments on this item from members of the public. We do
have a card on this now, and Mr. Paulson, are there any
members of the public on Zoom who wish to speak? Again, if
you’d please come to the microphone to speak and state your
name and address, if you wish.
CATHERINE SOMERS: I’m Catherine Somers,
Executive Director at the Los Gatos Chamber of Commerce.
I’m surprised there are not a lot more people wanting to
speak on this issue.
I’m here on behalf of my Board of Directors. We
would like to express our appreciation of the Staff’s
continued work on economic recovery and streamlining of the
new business permitting process.
Certainly the June 2020 Economic Recovery
Resolution did create flexibility and increased
opportunities for existing and new businesses. We
particularly appreciate the subsidies provided for those
that wanted to update their CUPs; it added vitality and
vibrancy.
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Tonight we’re here to support almost everything
that the Staff recommends in this report as it relates to
making that 2020 resolution permanent, however, we have a
few exceptions.
We hope tonight you will take a little closer
look at the language around specialty retail and how it
might relate to the coffee industry. The downtown core
currently has a unique and abundant variety of coffee
businesses. We feel the discretion provided at the
Development Review Committee level would be appropriate to
guide any newly proposed coffee businesses in the C-2. In
other areas, we’re not as concerned.
We also want to point out that for formula
retailers 5,000 square feet was a policy meant to regulate
larger box retail. In hindsight, that number could have
been altered or addressed a few years ago when the
resolution was put in place and it was not. There are some
spaces in the Commercial zone, again C-2, that would
benefit from marketability of what would be considered a
formula use as an approved use within the zone. There are
leases in place, building size, and other constraints that
self-regulate the concern of overly competitive big box
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retailers entering the market and creating destructive
competition for our Mom and Pop retailers.
The notion of formula retail is antiquated. With
the aggressively changing landscape of retail we almost
want to welcome a few quality retailers that are left to
bolster our shopping experience and gain tax revenue. We
suggest eliminating this limitation completely.
Lastly, we also think the definition of banks and
financial institutions needs to be more straightforward.
Recalling the Planning Commission meeting about a year ago,
you unanimously agreed to allow Charles Schwab to open in
the now vacated Gap space. The Chamber appealed that. The
Council agreed with our appeal and denied the project. In
that we did say that the definition should include ATMs and
having cash on hand. I think you should really be specific
with that definition so that we don’t run into that same
problem, that is, if you do not want to have offices on the
ground floor.
Again, we appreciate everything that you do and
all of the elements of this plan.
CHAIR BARNETT: Thanks so much for that
presentation and for all you do for the Town of Los Gatos.
Are there any questions? Commissioner Hanssen.
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COMMISSIONER HANSSEN: Thank you as always for
your great comments and help in what we’re doing for our
town businesses. There was a letter in the addendum from
one of our General Plan Committee members who is also an
architect raising the question about the competition with
the small businesses, and I felt like I knew the answer to
it because I attended a presentation on the future of
retail about five years ago, and everything has come true
and is continuing to come true.
My question to you is I don't know if you’ve seen
that letter, but do you feel confident that were we to make
these changes that we aren’t going to push out a bunch of
small business owners that would want to be setting up
retail locations?
CATHERINE SOMERS: I have a perfect example of
that. Our House, which is taking over Banana Republic and
the Sur La Table space, I want to say—and Monica Renn may
know—it’s at least 8,000 square feet; it’s a huge space. I
was a little concerned when I heard they were coming into
the Old Town space, and before I could even go out and talk
to some of our members or business owners that I know,
Cherie Rose said it’s awesome that they’re coming. She said
that, and so did The Maids Quarters, and the reason is when
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you have a draw like that in town people come to that, but
then they stay and they have lunch and then they venture
into Cherie Rose, and they go into The Maids Quarters, and
the go into the boutiques. Those big retailers that are now
out there that have made it through all of this attrition
of all the legacy stores, those are the ones that people
come to and they will help our Mom and Pops; I really
believe that.
CHAIR BARNETT: Commissioner Thomas.
COMMISSIONER THOMAS: I have a follow up to that
question, and again, thank you for coming tonight and
offering some suggestions. Do you feel like your members
feel that way with Sephora and Anthropologie there? Sephora
is not that big, but is that what they’re seeing with those
two locations, that people are coming to those spots and
then staying around downtown?
CATHERINE SOMERS: Yes. As much as competition is
certainly a thing I think it’s the crowd massing that is
more important, and so people are coming for Sephora.
Again, exactly as I said to Commissioner Hanssen, they do
then walk around. They park once and they’re like what else
does this town have to offer? I’m going to come here for
dinner. They see so much, Anthropologie, all of those
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stores. Warby Parker, a huge addition to town because
people are coming here for that and then they venture out
and see everything else that we have here.
COMMISSIONER THOMAS: I do have a follow up, if
that’s okay.
CHAIR BARNETT: Please.
COMMISSIONER THOMAS: You just want to eliminate
all… There are no issues associated with that? Can you just
repeat your recommendation?
CATHERINE SOMERS: That’s a big ask, and that is
what my board actually does recommend, eliminating it
completely, partly because they think—and Monica Renn could
answer some of this as well—the market economics downtown,
first of all there are not that many spaces that are over
10,000 feet. The Williams Sonoma, (inaudible) Ranch, that
whole space is 6,800 square feet, and that would be more
marketable to a really high-end, cool retailer if it
doesn’t have all these restrictions and other stuff lopped
onto it that’s going to take a long time to go through the
building process. Those big companies still look at all
that stuff and think how do I come in easily and open up
shop as quickly as I can, which is what Our House was able
to do. I don't know if that answered your question. I don’t
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think you have that problem downtown. I don’t think you
have to worry downtown that that’s going to happen, that
there are going to be retailers that we don’t like
downtown. We want to make it as easy as possible.
COMMISSIONER THOMAS: Thank you. My other
question was could you clarify the definition about the
banks?
CATHERINE SOMERS: With the banks, I don't know
if you remember, last year it was Charles Schwab, I
believe, that wanted to go in where the Gap space is, and
it was a big contentious debate about what qualified as a
bank. We really believe that to be a banking institution,
or to consider yourself a bank where people are going in
and out all day so that it brings people in, it’s not an
office, you really do need to have an ATM and you need to
have cash on hand that you’re doing transactions with
people, and you’re talking and you’re not just going into
your office; an office is like a Charles Schwab.
That brings up a whole other conversation really
about our banks in town have such a big footprint; it’s
like what to do with them as we move through. I think that
may be next to come, but I think banks are getting smaller
and smaller, and so you really do want to make sure that
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you have that face-to-face communication at the banks.
Maybe that’s the other thing you put in, there’s got to be
some face-to-face or at least face with an ATM machine.
COMMISSIONER THOMAS: Okay, thank you.
CHAIR BARNETT: Other questions of the speaker?
No. Thank you very much. We have a card from Bess Wiersema.
BESS WIERSEMA: Hi, I’m Bess Wiersema; I’m a
local architect. You guys all know me probably from my one
business, Studio3, which is in town.
I also own another business called Shop the
Studio that is a trade only showroom, and it occupies about
8,000 square feet and it sits at that second level of the
opera house.
I would like to concur and support exactly what
the Chamber is saying, because I hear it from both my own
clients at Studio3 who are looking to have maybe some work
done on their own homes or are building a home, but as well
as a ton of other designers and architects that use the
trade show room that we operate, and that is that if
downtown is vital it’s easier for them to get clients to
come and visit here and stay more.
One might assume that Our House going in, similar
to like a Restoration Hardware or something, might be in
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direct competition with a designer who maybe wants to be
able to sell to the trade or only product available as
opposed to having their clients go in and shop at an Our
House, a Restoration Hardware, or Harvest or anything like
that, but honestly, they’ve all said that they welcome it,
just like Cherie Rose did.
I think the more we can establish ourselves as a
boutique destination with not big box stores that are like
Bed Bath and Beyond or Walmart, but with ones that fit at
that more niche level, and those are the kinds of
businesses that are only going to take 10,000 square feet
or less.
Those of us who have to do business plans and
qualify for SBA and meet the general needs of running a
business, whether it’s retail or trade only, manage all the
time any bank loans with what is the footprint of our
space. How much traffic are we getting, and how can we
increase traffic to us while still maintaining the unique
nature of why we have chosen to be in a location.
I would encourage you to let the architecture of
the space and the footprint of the space do the talking,
and eliminate exactly what you’re afraid of and create a
space and a place that can become something besides just
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the same old stuff that we see downtown, because that’s the
only thing right now we’re attracting is the same thing
that we all know exists. That’s it, just a local business
owner.
CHAIR BARNETT: Before you go, I want to ask
Commissioners if they have any questions of you. I’m not
seeing any, so thanks again.
We don’t have anyone on Zoom or a further card,
so I will now close the public portion of the public
hearing on Item 2.
I’m going to propose to my fellow commissioners
that we proceed through each of the suggested amendment
groups A-F in turn and ask the Commissioners on each item
if they have questions of Staff, wish to comment on the
request, or make a motion to the Town Council concerning
the proposed amendments. I understand that each motion will
need to include the required findings that are in Exhibit 1
on page 27 of the report. Let’s see if we have anything
further before we go on.
It was my intent to see if we can get through
this item before we take a break, but if it ends up being
rather long, then we’ll certainly take a break, and anyone
can suggest that we do that.
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Is there a Staff Report on this item?
SEAN MULLIN: Staff would be happy to provide
additional detail if you’d like as we go item-to-item. I
didn’t prepare remarks, but I can provide a brief summary
as we go, or we can just answer questions, whatever you
prefer.
CHAIR BARNETT: Why don’t we proceed in that way?
Page 14, Item A, is Personal Service Businesses as a
permitted use in the C-2 and O zones, and this relates to
all the many businesses that are described there, which I
won’t read. I’ll ask Commissioners, based on the Staff
Report or any questions they may have of Staff, what their
thoughts are on that proposed amendment? Commissioner
Hanssen.
COMMISSIONER HANSSEN: After reading through it
the only question I have is the one that I brought up about
the massage parlors, and I’m satisfied with Staff’s
response to that in that they have to communicate with the
police department prior to operating their business anyway,
and we also have code enforcement and police enforcement
should anything happen.
Considering the spirit of this, that we really
need to give all our businesses all the help they can get
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(inaudible) think we should take away any more impediments
to opening these kind of businesses, and these are exactly
the kind of businesses that don’t have a lot of money to
throw into permits, so I would say yes on A.
CHAIR BARNETT: Other comments? Commissioner
Janoff.
COMMISSIONER JANOFF: I wanted to kind of back up
a bit and say what the Town did to provide assistance
during the pandemic. The Town was struggling before in some
respects with regard to retail; the pandemic just sort of
forced the issue. The changes that were put in place made a
whole lot of sense at that time, and they still make really
good sense. Reading through the entire item, I was happy to
see so much good change that would be assisting businesses.
The other thing I’d like to say is we’ve been
reminded on occasion that businesses really know what
businesses need to do to be successful themselves, so
creating hurdles when we don’t need to have hurdles, when
business owners already know. They tick through the
requirements, what their expectations are, and this has
come up with regard to parking as well. If they can make an
argument for themselves and their bankers to be successful,
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then I think we should do whatever we can to make that a
successful outcome, so I’m also in favor of item A.
CHAIR BARNETT: Thank you. Commissioner Thomas.
COMMISSIONER THOMAS: I had a question about
adding personal service businesses to the required parking
for retail and commercial shops. I know that we’re kind of
the trend around the country and here in that we’re trying
to reduce parking minimums and everything, so could you
just elaborate on that and talk about what’s happening with
that? Thank you.
SEAN MULLIN: Sure, thank you. This is actually
just recognizing formally how we already regulate it; it’s
just not in the code. This is an opportunity not only to
introduce these streamlined processes and flexibility, but
also to catch some things that are contained in Staff’s
knowledge and put it in the code to provide more clarity
and make it easier moving forward.
COMMISSIONER THOMAS: So we’re already doing this
is basically what we’re saying?
SEAN MULLIN: That’s correct.
COMMISSIONER THOMAS: Is there any concern that
we soon in the future might be moving away from what we are
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currently doing because the trend is to go away from
parking minimums and things?
SEAN MULLIN: I think Planning Manager Armer can
speak to that.
JENNIFER ARMER: Thank you for that question.
Yes, I would say that we do hope in the future to be
looking comprehensively at our parking regulations, but at
this time it is helpful to Staff to be able to have that
clarity in the code consistent with what the regulations
are for other uses.
COMMISSIONER THOMAS: So we would have to update.
If this is included, it’s not like then we’re going to have
to go back and undo it, because we’re going to have to go
back and undo a lot of stuff across all of our code?
JENNIFER ARMER: Correct. I anticipate a
comprehensive update if we do get to the point of updating
parking code.
COMMISSIONER THOMAS: Perfect. Thank you.
CHAIR BARNETT: Other questions or comments on
this item? Vice Chair Raspe.
VICE CHAIR RASPE: Thank you, Chair. Just a
procedural comment as to the form of the motion. I
understand we have several changes that would be included.
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Would the motion include all those changes, or could we
simply refer to changes noted in the report?
SEAN MULLIN: You could simply refer to the
report.
VICE CHAIR RASPE: With that being said, Chair,
I’d like to make a motion.
CHAIR BARNETT: Please proceed.
VICE CHAIR RASPE: Thank you. With respect to the
category of Personal Services Businesses as a permitted use
in the C-2 and O zones, I would like to forward a
recommendation to the Town Council for the changes as noted
in the Staff Report on page 5 of our Staff Report
specifically. Do I have to make specific findings?
JENNIFER ARMER: You can make the findings that
are listed at the end of the report, or we could have a
final motion referring back to the individual motions, at
which time the findings could be made; it’s up to the
Commission.
VICE CHAIR RASPE: Chair, I’ll just make the
findings as referred in the report so it’s a self-contained
motion.
CHAIR BARNETT: Very good. Do we have a second?
Commissioner Janoff.
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COMMISSIONER JANOFF: Second.
CHAIR BARNETT: Discussion? Seeing none, I’ll
take the roll. Commissioner Hanssen.
COMMISSIONER HANSSEN: Yes.
CHAIR BARNETT: Commissioner Thomas.
COMMISSIONER THOMAS: Yes.
CHAIR BARNETT: Vice Chair Raspe.
VICE CHAIR RASPE: Yes.
CHAIR BARNETT: Commissioner Burnett.
COMMISSIONER BURNETT: Yes.
CHAIR BARNETT: Commissioner Janoff.
COMMISSIONER JANOFF: Yes.
CHAIR BARNETT: And I vote yes as well, so it
passes unanimously.
Now we can move on to Item B, which is on page
16, and this concerns Bars, Markets, and other
miscellaneous commercial businesses, and Staff is standing
by for any questions that we may have, but at this time I’m
going to invite any questions or comments that
Commissioners may have on Item B. Commissioner Hanssen.
COMMISSIONER HANSSEN: I was just going to make a
comment that I read through the comments on Item B and I
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didn’t find anything that needed to be changed or that I
was concerned about.
CHAIR BARNETT: Thank you. Other comments? Vice
Chair Raspe.
VICE CHAIR RASPE: Thanks, Chair. Just one
question. The tap tasting room has operating hours of 10am
to 10pm, and I was curious as to how those hours were
determined? Is it what other jurisdictions are using? I’m
curious as to how we came up with that definition.
SEAN MULLIN: Thank you for that question. We
looked at some businesses in other cities and looked at
their hours. I tried to find some other municipalities that
had this category and I wasn’t very successful in that. But
we also recognized what the ABC licensing would be for
alcohol, which is I believe it’s like 6am to 2am, and
wanted to make a strong distinction between a bar and a tap
tasting room. The opening times of similar businesses that
we found was not before 11am, so we decided to give the
flexibility of 10am and then 10pm as consistent with what
we found with these types of businesses, and that also
aligns with our Entertainment Policy.
VICE CHAIR RASPE: Thanks for that answer.
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CHAIR BARNETT: Other question or comments? I
have one issue and I think it’s a very small nit, but on
the bottom of page 17 the last sentence says, “Food service
is not required for tasting rooms or taps,” and I wanted to
raise the question with Staff whether that should be made,
“Food service is possible but not required”?
SEAN MULLIN: We could certainly make that change
if that helps clarity. I think in the end it says the same
thing, but if it’s more approachable with that language, we
certainly can make that change.
CHAIR BARNETT: I appreciate that. Commissioner
Hanssen.
COMMISSIONER HANSSEN: I had one question with
regard to what Ms. Somers brought up. What she said about
coffee, that it would be a self-resolving process, I just
wanted to bring up if there was any discussion that we
needed to have around that, because we went through a thing
a few years ago where we had a bunch of juice companies,
cold pressed juices—and they even brought juices to the
Commission—so you can get this herd effect. I’m asking a
question of the other Commissioners or Staff: Do we need to
worry about having too many coffee places?
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MONICA RENN: The coffee is actually captured
under the specialty retail, so the next…
COMMISSIONER HANSSEN: Is that a separate
category?
MONICA RENN: Are we doing those all under B?
COMMISSIONER HANSSEN: I thought it was all under
B.
MONICA RENN: If the Commission will indulge me
for a minute, I spoke with the Board president of the
Chamber at length yesterday and we walked through different
stakeholder groups and what their position was on the
coffee piece.
From a Staff perspective what we try to do is
present the Commission with a very wide menu, really wide
open, and Mr. Foley and I started walking through some of
the possibilities and some different things that have
happened in the past, and I think what Commissioner Hanssen
is referring to is just different cycles of businesses, and
coffee seemed to be one that could be concerning.
Right now a coffee house is a restaurant. Once
you do something made-to-order it becomes a restaurant, so
when we were looking at this new specialty retail
definition we tried to align it with our traffic impact fee
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definition, which does include coffee, and the concern from
the Board president of the Chamber is when there is a
public hearing, even though any coffee house could come in
and apply for a Conditional Use Permit through a restaurant
and would likely go through the process, there’s still a
public noticing, and so he felt like for the sake of some
of our smaller coffee shops having that public hearing was
a piece of mind for them, and so I think that’s where those
comments from the Chamber are stemming from.
It’s not like we don’t want any more coffee shops
or we’re trying to say no juice or no this or that, but
there are some things that could throw off the balance, and
so on one hand we let the market control what happens, and
then on the other hand I think there is some preservation
and that Los Gatos has always come from a place of
presentation, so I do think that’s where the concern came
from and it was definitely coffee-specific, but I think
that the Commission could definitely talk a little bit
about that definition and your comfort level with it based
on how the Chamber feels about that made-to-order piece
being added and now being allowed by right.
COMMISSIONER HANSSEN: What you said, for
example, Great Bear Coffee is considered a restaurant?
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MONICA RENN: Correct. Actually, anything that
makes something to order, so every ice cream shop,
everything that you can walk up and specialize something is
a restaurant.
CHAIR BARNETT: Did that answer the question?
COMMISSIONER HANSSEN: Yes. It sounded to me like
there might be further discussion, but since people that
have made-to-order foods are not part of this streamline
process, they would have to go through the process that a
restaurant would.
MONICA RENN: Correct, which is the DRC.
Specialty retail is a by right use and it does not need a
CUP, whereas a restaurant does, and so what we were looking
at with this modification was to broaden the specialty
retail definition and allow businesses that may have been
restaurant before to now be a specialty retail, a frozen
yogurt shop for example, so it would really be the
Commission’s purview to look at that and see where you
think that stop/start should be between a restaurant and a
specialty retailer. Perhaps you think what the Town has
been doing works; that could also be a recommendation
that’s going to Council. I just don’t want to stand up here
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and advocate for something that I’ve heard very strongly
from one of our biggest business advocates in town.
CHAIR BARNETT: Other questions or comments?
Commissioner Janoff.
COMMISSIONER JANOFF: Just to clarify, on page 20
we have a table and the coffee house is showing current
code as a CUP and a DRC approval. The amended use is
specialty shop over the counter, and I want to clarify, is
what we’re hearing tonight the recommendation that a coffee
shop not be moved to a specialty use?
MONICA RENN: This is what we’ve heard from the
Chamber, correct. I think what Ms. Somers came forward and
was asking was that particularly coffee shop causes a pain
point if we move it into the specialty retail category.
COMMISSIONER JANOFF: All right, thank you.
CHAIR BARNETT: Further questions, comments?
Motion? Commissioner Thomas.
COMMISSIONER THOMAS: I have a question for
fellow commissioners and Staff, I guess. How do we
distinguish between… I guess where do we draw the line?
That’s what Ms. Renn is saying, that we need to decide. So
what type of business is considered specialty, that we feel
like is specialty food retail versus a full restaurant? I
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do understand right now if there is any food prepared, it’s
a restaurant and everything is considered a restaurant, but
we do need to be moving more options into specialty food
retail shops so that smaller places can open. Where do you
all see us drawing the line? What type of food retail? And
I don't know if you guys have some other definitions, or
where this was pulled from, or what other towns have done.
Any more information would be helpful.
SEAN MULLIN: I can offer a couple of things.
First, the definition was sort of developed by looking at
the two policies that are floating around with the Town,
the Traffic Impact Policy and the Director’s Policy, and in
close consultation with Monica on the reality of the
business community. Planning Staff doesn’t always have our
ear to the ground with that, so it’s very valuable to get
that information.
The second piece that I’d point out is just from
a functional standpoint. If there’s a particular category
that you see listed here in this draft definition that you
didn’t want to include, instead of just removing it from
the definition we can specifically call it out that it is
not considered specialty food retail or that it is still
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considered a restaurant, but we can take your direction and
provide that.
CHAIR BARNETT: Follow up?
COMMISSIONER THOMAS: I hear that in my brain,
and this is for my fellow commissioners, like what is the
difference between coffee and, let’s say, tea at the tea
shops that are downtown versus really then what is the
difference between the tea shops and yogurt places? That’s
what I want you guys to tell me. Thank you.
CHAIR BARNETT: Commissioner Hanssen.
COMMISSIONER HANSSEN: I want to ask a clarifying
question. I’m looking again at page 20 and it says, “Frozen
yogurt shop, coffee house,” and then, “specialty food
retail shop offering alcohol for offsite on onsite
consumption.” So in the case of a coffee house, if I
understand what Staff just said, the Chamber was advocating
for us not to include coffee houses even though it was in
the Staff Report this way, so a possible recommendation
from us could be to say yes, because we’re concerned about
potential conflicts with the existing businesses, we would
do everything except for coffee houses and leave coffee
houses the way it is now where they have to have a CUP?
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SEAN MULLIN: That’s the potential motion,
correct.
COMMISSIONER HANSSEN: That’s a potential outcome
of this.
CHAIR BARNETT: Vice Chair Raspe.
VICE CHAIR RASPE: Thanks, Chair. I wanted to
respond to Commissioner Thomas’ comment; I think it’s a
good one. I think logically there is no difference between
a coffee shop, a tea shop, a juice shop, and as I read the
definition this past week to me it was a logical grouping
that it made sense to treat equally.
That being said, it’s clear that there’s
something more than words going on here, there’s an
economic impact that these words would ascribe to our
community and that specifically impacts the coffee houses,
and so to me the difference then is not the words, it’s the
result of those words, and I think we need to lean into our
Chamber.
If the Chamber believes that including the
language of specialty foods has a deleterious impact on
those businesses, then perhaps the best is to exclude
coffee houses from specialty and proceed that way even
though logically they’re grouped together, because the
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impact would result in something that as a town we don’t
want.
CHAIR BARNETT: Thank you for that comment.
Commissioner Janoff.
COMMISSIONER JANOFF: Great question,
Commissioner Thomas. I think if we were only looking at the
size of business, type of business, then there really isn’t
a difference, but I appreciate the comments that Mr. Mullin
has made regarding Staff didn’t know, so we checked with
Economic Vitality and Economic Vitality is checking with
the Chamber of Commerce. This means experts are talking to
experts about what we don’t fundamentally know, because
we’re probably not shop owners of this nature.
So while it may seem like it’s an inconsistency
to treat one type of what could be a specialty use
differently, I think the economic arguments that have been
presented to us tonight are compelling. We don’t have juice
makers or ice cream shops or other issues coming to us,
it’s just this one particular niche, and I think if we
respect our community and want our community to thrive, we
do what we need to do to ensure that that happens, so I’m
comfortable making a motion that would remove the coffee
house from the specialty use.
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CHAIR BARNETT: Other comments or questions? If
not, that sounded like a motion. Commissioner Thomas.
COMMISSIONER THOMAS: I just want to ask Staff,
do we need any justification other than we just want to do
this? This isn’t putting us in legal jeopardy of being sued
because what’s the difference between coffee and tea or
something like that, correct?
JENNIFER ARMER: Unfortunately, we don’t have our
Town Attorney with us this evening, but this is a
recommendation to Town Council as to what types of business
you want to be seeing in different parts of town.
One thing I’d say, and I think you’ve already
discussed it some, is that there may be some kind of tricky
situations where somebody has got a juice shop but they
want to serve coffee, or it’s a tea house but they want to
have coffee available and how do we draw that line? That’s
one of the things that Staff would then have to work to
implement, so it does make it a little less clear, but if
that is the direction the Planning Commission wants to go,
then that could be added as an exclusion from the
definition of specialty food retail that’s on page 19 of
your Staff Report.
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COMMISSIONER THOMAS: As a follow up to that, I
think that just because this is a recommendation and just
going to Town Council that hopefully we can continue to
reach out to the community and make sure there’s not any
other categories that would feel particularly impacted,
like coffee houses would be, because I wouldn’t want them
to miss the opportunity and for our downtown character to
be changed drastically, because we have some other
longstanding businesses like Dolce Spazio has been there
for a very long time; I don't know if that would be a
concern of theirs too. So I am comfortable and I’m happy
that we had this discussion, but in forwarding this
recommendation to Town Council I would request that we
investigate and make sure that coffee is the only one that
should be switched.
MONICA RENN: If I may, given the fact that the
conversation that I had with the president happened so late
in the game—it happened yesterday morning—I think before I
can commit to you, before we go to the Council, we will do
some more discussions at the Chamber. We can even invite in
some of the businesses and have some conversations, and
also do a little more benchmarking on maybe what other
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communities do; we’ll check in with our attorney. I hear
those concerns and I share them.
I think the number one thing that we were trying
to reach was transparency with this one so that the
community felt heard if all of a sudden we had a 5,000
square foot coffee house come in that could afford that,
because the majority of our small ones can’t and don’t.
It’s really difficult because it is a case-by-
case and kind of an environmental issue, like what that
issue is in that exact location, but I can commit to doing
a little more background and research so that we have some
more information when we get to the Council. Thank you.
CHAIR BARNETT: I’m looking for raised hands or a
motion. Vice Chair Raspe.
VICE CHAIR RASPE: I can try the motion again.
With respect to the category Bars, Markets, and Other
Miscellaneous Commercial Businesses I move that we forward
a recommendation to Town Council to accept and implement
the changes noted by Staff in the report, subject to the
change that the definition of specialty food retail would
not include coffee/tea houses.
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Point of clarification: do you want to include a
specific exclusion for it or just remove the language of
coffee houses?
CHAIR BARNETT: I’d defer to Staff on that issue.
VICE CHAIR RASPE: Can we just remove the
language, or should we insert a specific exclusion?
JENNIFER ARMER: Because there is an interest in
not allowing coffee houses to use the specialty retail
definition, we would recommend that that be specifically
excluded. My understanding from your conversation was that
tearooms or teahouses would still be maintained as part of
it.
VICE CHAIR RASPE: Yes, so again, forward the
recommendation with changes noted by Staff as presented in
the report, with the change of the definition specialty
food retail to delete the word “coffee” in the phrase
“coffee/teahouses,” and to insert language specifically
excluding coffee houses from the definition of specialty
food retail. Chair, did you also have one additional change
to add language?
CHAIR BARNETT: I think Mr. Mullin gave me the
answer I needed in terms of clarification, but thank you.
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VICE CHAIR RASPE: Very good. And as part of the
motion I will make the findings as set forth in the Staff
Report.
CHAIR BARNETT: Thank you for that complete
motion. Commissioner Hanssen.
COMMISSIONER HANSSEN: I’ll second the motion,
but I would ask if the maker of the motion would agree to
request that Staff do the additional research we discussed
before going to Council to make sure that we aren’t
creating a problem of unintended consequences?
VICE CHAIR RASPE: Absolutely agree. Thank you.
CHAIR BARNETT: So we have a motion and a second.
Any discussion? Seeing none, I’ll call the roll.
Commissioner Hanssen.
COMMISSIONER HANSSEN: Yes.
CHAIR BARNETT: Commissioner Thomas.
COMMISSIONER THOMAS: Yes.
CHAIR BARNETT: Vice Chair Raspe.
VICE CHAIR RASPE: Yes.
CHAIR BARNETT: Commissioner Burnett.
COMMISSIONER BURNETT: Yes.
CHAIR BARNETT: Commissioner Janoff.
COMMISSIONER JANOFF: Yes.
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CHAIR BARNETT: And I vote as well in favor of
the motion, and so it passes unanimously. Thank you for
that.
Forging ahead, we’ll move on to Item C, Banks and
Financial and Investment Services. Are we going to have a
public hearing on each of these items, or it was already
covered by the blanketed first? Okay. I’ll ask if there are
any questions of Staff on this matter, comments, or a
motion? Commissioner Janoff.
COMMISSIONER JANOFF: I just wanted to point out
the comment made regarding the definition of a bank, and we
had this robust conversation when we were considering Chase
moving into the Gap space. I think it’s a clear definition
to include. The point that was the main issue of
disagreement was whether Schwab was offering cash exchange
or that kind of service, and I think it’s a good addition
to add.
CHAIR BARNETT: Other comments? I agree
completely. That was a very hard decision to be made by the
Planning Commission on the Schwab matter. Commissioner
Hanssen.
COMMISSIONER HANSSEN: While you were talking, I
was looking at the definition and it does not specifically
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say cash per se. It does not include payday lending
businesses or check cashing, but I don’t think people are
going to think about that. It was more about like having an
ATM, so I concur we should add that to the definition that
people would be able to withdraw cash using ATM or other
methods.
CHAIR BARNETT: Vice Chair Raspe.
VICE CHAIR RASPE: Thank you. Yes, I think ATMs
should somehow be incorporated within the definition of
bank. My concern is ATMs are so ubiquitous now that they’re
in facilities that are not banks. They’re in grocery
stores, they’re in standalone kiosks, so my concern is if
we throw ATM into the bank definition it might create
issues.
CHAIR BARNETT: Commissioner Janoff.
COMMISSIONER JANOFF: Thank you. I think the
clarification to the definition I’m interested in seeing is
ATM and cash, because certainly we don’t want to be like a
7-Eleven that’s got an ATM machine, so I think the notion
that there has to be a person there whose function as a
clerk is to distribute cash would be part of the change of
the definition.
CHAIR BARNETT: Further comments?
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COMMISSIONER THOMAS: Yes, I was thinking like a
teller also; I think that’s what they’re still calling bank
tellers. But also I did have some questions about that,
because I know that banks have really changed their hours
of operation; like Bank of America is not open a lot, the
one over at Blossom Hill and Los Gatos Boulevard. Is that
just the trend that is happening? All of those bank-like
retail locations are just not becoming a thing anymore, so
if we add this definition are we basically saying no more
banks in town? Not that there’s a problem with that, but is
that what might possibly happen?
MONICA RENN: You bring up an amazing point. This
is something that we’ve talked about with the Chamber quite
a bit, just how much real estate in general a bank takes up
and then how little interaction there is. Mr. Mullin may
want to expand on this, but I think what we’re really
trying to do is with the absence of a definition of a bank
it caused some issues with us, so we can still have that
conversation about what we want to do in general with banks
and zoning at another time, but I think what we were trying
to achieve here is that now we have a tool or a mechanism
to say yes you’re a bank or no you’re not, and then I think
it’s a much broader conversation, but you are right on.
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Is it appropriate on every other block downtown
anymore or not? But I think this is really just giving us
the opportunity to define it and then they would go through
the CUP process, so it doesn’t allow it by right, it just
defines it.
COMMISSIONER THOMAS: As a follow up to that I
think that we would have to put in a minimum number of
hours that they are available to the public, because if
they’re only open one hour a day for one day a week, by
definition they’re going to be a bank if they have a teller
there one hour a day, one day a week. I don't know, so
that’s something, maybe not. But now I understand and I do
think that that’s a good future discussion.
CHAIR BARNETT: I have a question for Staff. The
benefit of the distinction between retail bank and
financial services, although they have common features,
would be that financial services would be in offices only
in the C-2 zone?
SEAN MULLIN: That’s correct. As we saw during
the Schwab debate, with the lack of definition we were
relying on the applicant in that case to tell us what a
bank was, essentially not having a code to fall back on.
We’re not changing the regulatory framework for banks and
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financial institutions; we’re just trying to draw a clear
distinction between the two.
CHAIR BARNETT: Understood, thank you.
Commissioner Hanssen.
COMMISSIONER HANSSEN: I just wanted to add for
clarity, because not everyone was on the Commission when we
had the discussion about Schwab, they were going to open in
a very prime retail space on University and they were
posturing as if they would be accessible. Then the
questions were could people just walk in, and then they
were like hesitating a bit, and then the question came up
about whether or not someone could withdraw cash, and
Schwab is not that kind of organization, they aren’t set up
for that.
I think the way it’s explained here on page 20,
it says, “Primarily focus on in-person and customer
services such as deposits, withdrawals, loans, checking and
savings, currency exchanges, mortgages, personal loans.”
That’s not financial advisory like Schwab, so I think
there’s enough differentiation; if we add in including cash
withdrawals onsite, that would add the one thing that a lot
of people would go to the bank for. I don't know what to
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think about the number of hours, but maybe that’s a broader
discussion that’s beyond this.
CHAIR BARNETT: Commissioner Janoff.
COMMISSIONER JANOFF: Thank you, and I would
agree that, again, adding cash clarifies it in a way that
we didn’t have available before.
As far as hours of operation, to me that’s a
business model question. You might change banks if it’s
only open one hour a day, but I’m not sure that we’re in
the business of dictating the hours of the institution, but
I would be comfortable adding cash. More than cash and ATM,
but cash for sure.
CHAIR BARNETT: I was going to ask the question
about an ATM, because I’m not sure I see ATMs inside a
bank; they’re frequently on the outside of the bank, so is
that what we’re talking about specifically?
COMMISSIONER HANSSEN: I think it was more that
you could get cash in the venue. I think it is a slippery
slope with the ATMs, because ATMs are everywhere. Sometimes
they’re at gas stations, they’re in the grocery stores,
they could be in the pharmacy; I wouldn’t consider any of
those a bank. The definition has to be broader, that they
offer a range of service, including cash withdrawals. We
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may not even need to mention the word ATM, because a cash
withdrawal is one service that can be performed at an ATM,
but you can do others, so I would just say cash
withdrawals.
CHAIR BARNETT: All right. Anything further? A
motion perhaps? Commissioner Hanssen.
COMMISSIONER HANSSEN: I will make a motion that
we should forward a recommendation of approval to Town
Council regarding the changes recommended in Item C, and I
can make the findings for CEQA and for the General Plan,
but that we should modify the definition of retail bank to
include cash withdrawals in addition to the other items
mentioned.
CHAIR BARNETT: And a second? Commissioner
Janoff.
COMMISSIONER JANOFF: Second.
CHAIR BARNETT: Discussion on the motion?
Commissioner Thomas.
COMMISSIONER THOMAS: Just to clarify, so just
put “cash” in front of “deposit/withdrawals”?
COMMISSIONER HANSSEN: I think that’s fine.
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CHAIR BARNETT: Was that an amendment? No.
Clarification, right? Discussion? I don’t see any. I’ll
call the roll? Commissioner Hanssen.
COMMISSIONER HANSSEN: Yes.
CHAIR BARNETT: Commissioner Thomas.
COMMISSIONER THOMAS: Yes.
CHAIR BARNETT: Vice Chair Raspe.
VICE CHAIR RASPE: Yes.
CHAIR BARNETT: Commissioner Burnett.
COMMISSIONER BURNETT: Yes.
CHAIR BARNETT: Commissioner Janoff.
COMMISSIONER JANOFF: Yes.
CHAIR BARNETT: And I vote in favor of it as
well, so it’s unanimously approved.
We’re making good progress, so why don’t we move
on to Item D, which is on PDF page 21 of the Staff Report.
I’ll ask if any of the Commissioners have questions of
Staff on this matter, wish to comment on it, or make a
motion? Yes, Commissioner Hanssen will start.
COMMISSIONER HANSSEN: I asked a little bit of
questions earlier, because we also had gotten the letter in
the addendum. Maybe five years ago the Planning Commission
was given an opportunity to attend a presentation on the
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future of retail, and as we’re probably all familiar, it’s
been fairly bleak and it’s in the news every day about new
retail locations that are closing, and I think we’ve been
fortunate to keep as much retail as we’ve had in our
downtown.
What’s really happened in the last few years, I
think it was mentioned by Ms. Somers and also by our
Economic Vitality Manager, is that we have these businesses
that come in like Sephora and Lulu Lemon and whatnot, and
those are draw businesses and then people stay in town, and
I think we have to think like that.
The thing that people might be worried about,
which would be like is Walmart going to come in and open up
a huge thing, we just don’t have the real estate in
downtown to make that happen. I don’t think there is retail
space to do it anywhere in town honestly, maybe in the
outlying part of town, but in any case I think we should do
everything we can to make it easy for businesses to be
here, and retail businesses in particular, and removing the
CUP requirement I think is just fine, and just simply by
the amount of square footage we have and what’s available
that it will be a limiting factor to anything showing up.
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CHAIR BARNETT: Thank you for those comments? Any
further questions or comments? Commissioner Thomas.
COMMISSIONER THOMAS: I had a question for Staff
about if you know how many retail spaces are vacant right
now that are larger than 6,000 square feet?
MONICA RENN: Specifically, in downtown we have
one. We have the former Williams Sonoma. We actually had a
couple of formula retailers look at it and they passed; I
don't know if it was about the CUP or not; there are other
factors that businesses look at when they come in. Outside
of downtown we do have the former Rite Aid spot that’s
rather large that’s open, and off the top of my head I
think those are the only two big spaces.
COMMISSIONER THOMAS: Whatever is across the
street next to Lundardi’s too.
MONICA RENN: The Rite Aid.
COMMISSIONER THOMAS: No, the other right next
door, like in between the bank. It’s been nothing for a
long time. It was like a Hallmark shop, but then before
that it was like a Domus.
MONICA RENN: I do anticipate there being some
changes there just given that there is a long-term land
lease that’s about to expire on that space, and so that may
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have something to do with the tenants and turnover in the
tenants.
It’s really interesting, those shopping centers
function quite differently, because there is one owner that
has kind of an overview plan and idea, and then downtown we
have an amazing group of owners, 150 or so, and so it’s a
little bit different to do long-term planning, and I think
that leads to Ms. Somer’s comment about it’s harder to
think we’re just going to combine all of these shops and
it’s going to become this massive superstore; that’s less
likely to happen downtown given the way it functions.
CHAIR BARNETT: Commissioner Burnett.
COMMISSIONER BURNETT: Thank you, Chair. My
question is one of the comment letters that we received
about removing the CUP that we discussed, and of course our
great Chamber of Commerce manager, but what he said
basically was yes, remove the CUP requirement for the
Neighborhood Commercial and the CH, but keep it in the
Central District in the LM, the Commercial Industrial, and
the reason why he said, and it was an important point and I
wish to discuss this with the other Commissioners, was that
it would be an incentive for the businesses owners to help
retain the small businesses over… Basically it would help
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with the owners of the properties; it would be an
incentive. I don't know if there’s a discussion on that. It
could be a concern though if you think about it.
CHAIR BARNETT: I appreciate that comment.
Commissioner Janoff.
COMMISSIONER JANOFF: I think the question was
what about the amendment that we received and the
recommendation to keep big business or big box out of the
downtown area? I read that and thought good point, that’s a
really interesting point, however, the discussion tonight
has been very compelling in terms of wanting businesses to
come into town, and the limited number of sites that are
that size anyway, so it’s not likely to transform the
character of town, so with all due respect to Mr. Meyer,
who makes an interesting point, I’m listening to our
persons who are much more tightly tied to business and that
outweighs that comment for me, and I think I’m in favor of
what Staff has recommended for that reason.
CHAIR BARNETT: Thank you. Commissioner Burnett.
COMMISSIONER BURNETT: Yes, I appreciate that,
Commissioner Janoff, and I agree with you. I just wanted to
put that out as a question that was raised by Mr. Meyer and
I just wanted to address his concerns, but I do agree.
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CHAIR BARNETT: Other questions or comments? We
had a brief discussion with Mr. Paulson yesterday in
preparing for this meeting, and he brought to my attention
that the formula retail restriction has not always been in
place, and I was wondering if we had some notion of how
long it has been in place?
JOEL PAULSON: If I’m taking a guess, I want to
say 2004, but I could be off by a couple of years. When I
first started here many decades ago there was no
distinction, but then there became a concern with formula
retail in that mix and not wanting to upset that mix,
specifically downtown, so it was implemented, and then even
prior to the Economic Recovery Agreement stage we actually
pulled back for everything less than 6,000 square feet, so
it got modified at that point, and so now this is kind of
that final step.
The other piece is not only this, but any other
ones, because it’s the same thing with personal service
downtown. That used to be a permitted use, then there was a
concern that all of downtown was going to be salons. We
haven’t seen that happen, but that’s when that was put into
place, and if any of these things start becoming concerns
moving forward, Ms. Renn, the planners, they’re all going
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to keep an eye on that, and we have another discussion with
the Council and see if we want to look at maybe pulling
back from lessening these restrictions, so there is always
that opportunity too.
CHAIR BARNETT: Thanks for those comments, and I
think that’s good for us all to keep in mind. Commissioner
Thomas.
COMMISSIONER THOMAS: Thank you. I was hoping
that Staff could tell us why 6,000 square feet is the
number that’s chosen.
MONICA RENN: That was the number that was chosen
back in like 2004. We had a distinction between formula
retail under 6,000 square feet and then over, so anything
over 6,000 needed a CUP anywhere, and anything under only
needed the CUP in downtown, and that was the way to really
preserve the Mom and Pop retail through the time.
I did want to add when we removed the CUP for
under 6,000 square feet we did it for like a year,
temporary basis, and we came back to the Council and said
we’ve gotten none, would you like to extend it, and they
extended it again as a temporary basis. So this has now
been in place since 2018, and just as we’ve done those
quick kinds of trials, we could definitely come back to you
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and come back to the Council if things start to unravel and
ask do you want to try a temporary in the other direction.
COMMISSIONER THOMAS: So we could temporarily
require CUPs again? Okay.
MONICA RENN: And we have become kind of a leader
in the Bay Area, because for a long time everyone was doing
formula, and then the Town pulled back, and so other cities
will call and say, “What happened? Did the sky fall? Is
this okay?” So with this, and with the parklets, and with a
lot of our streamlining we’ve been out there as a leader in
the Silicon Valley, and a lot of jurisdictions look to us
for making these innovative changes.
COMMISSIONER THOMAS: Thank you. At the end of
this section it says are there specific types of formula
retailers that should still require a CUP, and along with
that should we discuss expanding it or forwarding with a
recommendation to it being a higher number than 6,000
square feet? What I heard from the Chamber is that it
should be higher. What I’m hearing from what’s happened,
like 6,000, thus far nothing has made a difference, so
should that number be bumped up to 8,000 or 10,000?
CHAIR BARNETT: Is there a comment from Staff on
that?
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MONICA RENN: I’m not 100% sure. That’s the first
time I’ve heard that comment, so I can’t speak for the
Chamber. We really don’t have any buildings in town that I
can think of outside of like warehouses that are that big.
It would really be something where someone combines them.
Most of the time if it’s going to be a new development
you’re going to hear about it anyway and it’s going to come
before the Planning Commission and the Council. This is
really looking at a change of use, so something that
exists, and then a new user comes in.
So you could certainly do that. I’ve heard in the
past people don’t like formula retail defined as seven or
more, they like it defined more like 50 or more locations
makes you a formula, or 100 or more locations make you a
formula, so if that was a better level of comfort, that’s
also something you could consider.
To be honest, when it comes to retail there’s
such a delicate balance between the synergy and the
competition, and even in-person shopping in general, that a
lot of this conversation has just become obsolete, because
those really big box retailers are online and they’re
looking for smaller footprints anyway; it doesn’t make
sense to occupy 10,000 or 12,000 square feet.
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COMMISSIONER THOMAS: And the Williams Sonoma is
6,800?
MONICA RENN: I believe it’s something like that.
It’s not bigger than that; it’s just over 6,000.
COMMISSIONER THOMAS: Okay, thank you.
CHAIR BARNETT: I’ll take Commissioner Janoff
next.
COMMISSIONER JANOFF: Thank you. I would
recommend we stick with the language we have, because it’s
the language we’ve been using. These are the parameters we
know. If we change more variables you can’t really measure
in the same way what change might… There’s nothing to
compare to, so you’d be changing something on top of
something else. So I would recommend that we stick with the
language that we’ve had, open it up as recommended by
Staff, and see what happens.
And then, as Staff has said, if it becomes a
problem it goes back to Council or comes back to the
Planning Commission for any modification and we’ll see it
then, but I like the idea of taking the historic language
and carrying it through to the next logical step, see what
happens, and then if another change needs to be made, we
can do that.
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CHAIR BARNETT: Thank you for that. Commissioner
Hanssen and then Vice Chair Raspe.
COMMISSIONER HANSSEN: I just have a comment. If
you look at what is being proposed here, that language is
all going away. The word formula will be gone, 6,000 square
feet will be gone, and it’s just going to be retail. Given
the dramatic changes in the retail landscape, we heard
testimony years ago from retailers here saying things like,
“People walk in our store. They go outside and go on the
Internet and buy it from somebody else,” and we need to
help these guys as much as we can, so I think we should do
like Commissioner Janoff suggested and stick with the
language here.
If there were any discussion worth having, it
would be is there any business that we would want to
exclude? I would advocate not to do that for the reasons I
just outlined, and then let the process go where it goes,
and if it turns out we have unintended consequences, we can
always pull things back.
CHAIR BARNETT: Thank you. Vice Chair Raspe.
VICE CHAIR RASPE: Thank you, Chair. The last
point that Commissioner Hansson made on whether we should
have any uses that we don’t want, we still want some
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limitation on; the one that’s noted in our report is
perhaps, by way of example, alcohol sales. Do we want to
allow without a CUP large alcohol sales? I know we’ve had,
for instance, BevMo! just opened up. I don't know how big
the BevMo! space was, but it seems to me that at least we
should consider maybe that’s a discussion we want to have
about that’s an area we may want to limit without the CUP.
If you can let me know how big the BevMo! space is. Do we
know?
SEAN MULLIN: I can add it. I’m not sure how
large the BevMo! space is, but I will add with the
specifics to alcohol the changes as proposed in here would
not remove the CUP requirement for any business that wants
to sell alcohol for onsite or offsite. The discussion point
added here was really about if there is this further
control for these formulas over 6,000 that sell alcohol, so
BevMo!, if this gets adopted and incorporated into the
Town, BevMo! would still require a CUP simply because the
existing conditional use table requires a CUP for offsite
sales of alcohol or onsite sales.
VICE CHAIR RASPE: So instead of belts and
suspenders, we have now have belts or suspenders, but we’re
still protected from…
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SEAN MULLIN: Alcohol would still require a CUP.
It may have not been the best example provided for a
discussion point in the Staff Report, but it will help you
clarify.
VICE CHAIR RASPE: Thank you very much.
CHAIR BARNETT: Any further questions or comments
on D? If not, I’m looking for a motion from the
Commissioners. Commissioner Hanssen.
COMMISSIONER HANSSEN: I will make a motion that
we should recommend to Council to adopt the changes under D
that are mentioned in the Staff Report on page 22, and I
can make the findings in accordance with CEQA, and also
that this is in compliance with the General Plan, and no
changes recommended from what’s in the Staff Report.
CHAIR BARNETT: Thank you for the motion. Is
there a second? Commissioner Thomas.
COMMISSIONER THOMAS: I second.
CHAIR BARNETT: Any discussion? If not, I’ll call
the roll beginning with Commissioner Hanssen.
COMMISSIONER HANSSEN: Yes.
CHAIR BARNETT: Commissioner Thomas.
COMMISSIONER THOMAS: Yes.
CHAIR BARNETT: Vice Chair Raspe.
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VICE CHAIR RASPE: Yes.
CHAIR BARNETT: Commissioner Burnett.
COMMISSIONER BURNETT: Yes.
CHAIR BARNETT: Commissioner Janoff.
COMMISSIONER JANOFF: Yes.
CHAIR BARNETT: And I vote yes as well; it passes
unanimously.
We’re making good progress. We have E and F to
complete, and E concerns Group Classes in the C-2 zone, and
I wonder if Commissioners would like to make any comments
on that matter? Specific issue? Maybe there is no
discussion required. If not, I’ll ask for a motion on Item
E, please. Vice Chair Raspe.
VICE CHAIR RASPE: I have no comment, and hearing
no comments from my fellow commissioners, I would make a
motion that with respect to Group Classes in the C-2 zone
we forward to Town Council to accept and incorporate the
changes recommended by Staff as set forth on page 13 of our
Staff Report, and I would additionally make the findings as
required.
CHAIR BARNETT: Thank you for the motion. Second?
Commissioner Janoff.
COMMISSIONER JANOFF: I’ll second.
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CHAIR BARNETT: Discussion? Commissioner Hanssen.
COMMISSIONER HANSSEN: I just wanted to mention,
since I was on the Commission when all these group classes
started, and now there are multiple cycle places, there’s
Pilates, Pure Barre and whatnot, that when we had the cycle
place on Santa Cruz it was a really long Planning
Commission discussion and ultimately it got approved. But
when you consider the retail environment, we have to
encourage things that bring people downtown, and so those
are the kinds of that will bring people downtown. Then that
was sort of when the juice companies started coming in and
they would go to the juice place next door, so this is all
good harmonic things that are happening, so I just wanted
to give my encouragement before we voted, and why.
CHAIR BARNETT: Thank you. So we have a motion
and a second. Is there any further discussion? If not, I’ll
call the roll. Commissioner Hanssen.
COMMISSIONER HANSSEN: Yes.
CHAIR BARNETT: Commissioner Thomas.
COMMISSIONER THOMAS: Yes.
CHAIR BARNETT: Vice Chair Raspe.
VICE CHAIR RASPE: Yes.
CHAIR BARNETT: Commissioner Janoff.
LOS GATOS PLANNING COMMISSION 4/26/2023
Item #2, Land Use and
Economic Recovery Town Code Amendments
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COMMISSIONER JANOFF: Yes.
CHAIR BARNETT: Commissioner Burnett.
COMMISSIONER BURNETT: Yes.
CHAIR BARNETT: And I vote yes as well, so that
matter passes unanimously as well, and we’re getting to the
end.
Item F, Veterinarians in the C1 zone, and I’ll
call for any questions or comments on that item. I’m not
seeing any, so why don’t we move ahead with a motion?
Commissioner Thomas.
COMMISSIONER THOMAS: I move to forward the
recommendation for Item F, Veterinarians in the C1 zone,
and stated in the Staff Report. I can make the required
findings and recommendations in the Staff Report.
CHAIR BARNETT: Thank you for that, and we’ll
look for a second. Commissioner Burnett.
COMMISSIONER BURNETT: I second that.
CHAIR BARNETT: Any discussion? Seeing none, I’ll
call the roll again. Commissioner Hanssen.
COMMISSIONER HANSSEN: Yes.
CHAIR BARNETT: Commissioner Thomas.
COMMISSIONER THOMAS: Yes.
CHAIR BARNETT: Vice Chair Raspe.
LOS GATOS PLANNING COMMISSION 4/26/2023
Item #2, Land Use and
Economic Recovery Town Code Amendments
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VICE CHAIR RASPE: Yes.
CHAIR BARNETT: Commissioner Burnett.
COMMISSIONER BURNETT: Yes.
CHAIR BARNETT: Commissioner Janoff.
COMMISSIONER JANOFF: Yes.
CHAIR BARNETT: And I vote as well in favor of
the motion, so it passes unanimously.
We’ll confirm that there are no appeal rights on
this matter, since it’s a recommendation.
JENNIFER ARMER: That is correct; since it’s a
recommendation to Town Council there are no appeal rights.
CHAIR BARNETT: And the findings have been made
on each of the separate motions, so I think we’re in good
shape there.
(END)
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